• markovs_gun@lemmy.world
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    8 days ago

    Do you own a home? Do you think that’s a worthwhile thing to do? Without debt, home ownership is basically completely out of reach for most people despite the fact that many people will earn enough money to buy a house in their lifetime. It allows you to pay for money now with money later. Debt is legitimately an extremely important part of an economy- there’s a reason it’s been invented by pretty much every agricultural society in history. As with most financial instruments, it started with farmers - it costs money to plant and grow a crop of grain, but that crop doesn’t produce money until you sell it at harvest time so you have an issue where if last year’s crop didn’t go so well due to weather and you are low on cash in the spring, you can’t afford to plant next year’s crop and get out of the hole. So borrowing money is the easiest way.

    This also works with businesses and governments. Say you want to buy a machine that prints designs on T shirts because you want to sell T shirts. You can’t afford the machine now, but you believe that you’d be able to with the money you could make from your T shirt business, so you go to the bank and convince them of the plan, and they give you money up front. Without debt, that T shirt business couldn’t happen unless you got a bunch of investors to help you out.

    • deegeese@sopuli.xyz
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      8 days ago

      I wonder what the housing market would look like if individuals couldn’t get mortgages, but investors couldn’t either?

      Availability of credit has a huge impact on prices, and landlordism is mostly founded on cheap credit.

      • markovs_gun@lemmy.world
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        8 days ago

        There are many examples of this being essentially the status quo in many places and historical eras and essentially it just makes housing availability worse since only the ultra wealthy can afford to build expensive structures and they just accumulate more wealth and power. Think about in the middle ages when a local lord would have to foot the bill to build townhouses completely up front but he and his descendants would retain ownership of them and demand payment to live in them for hundreds of years to come. There are places where access to credit is poor today where people basically live in makeshift shacks if they don’t rent because they can’t afford to buy houses otherwise. There are a lot of ways to fix land ownership and exploitation by landlords, but historically speaking, this was not it. I know nobody likes living in debt and debt can be used for exploitation, but completely abolishing credit simply will not have good outcomes as a whole.

        • theneverfox@pawb.social
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          7 days ago

          Feudalism had a lot of good points structurally, replace the lord with public servants and I don’t see the problem. The city builds the housing, and it becomes part of the tax revenue forever. If the city prices basic housing too high, economic activity falls, tax revenue falls, and the city declines

          Shanty towns aren’t good, but we haven’t fixed the problem, we just have homelessness now

            • theneverfox@pawb.social
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              7 days ago

              Feudalism didn’t make us destroy the entire world, did it?

              What were doing clearly isn’t working, maybe there’s something to democratic feudalism. Seriously, it fixes a lot of issues and all I see are engineering problems