• Proton VPN has hit back at Canada’s proposed Bill C-22
• The proposed legislation could require VPNs to log user metadata
• NordVPN and Windscribe have also slammed the bill
JFC were losing the internet everywhere… we’re just slaves to nation-states and corporations…
Turns out voting for conservatives has consequences.
Proton is not a trustworthy company.
Noone is 100% trust worthy. I’ll still appreciate when they fight for the right things.
I’ll still appreciate
whenif they fight for the right things.Proton has a long history of capitulation.
And they have a history of making promises they don’t keep.
In fact, it’s so bad that Proton defender @[email protected] wrote a warning about how their statement here is basically not to be trusted.
if 3 lines is a long comment for you, you should read more. For the others:
This AGAIN? They were ordered by a Swiss court to log the IP accessing the mailbox, (which the court granted because the French authorities cited terrorism as a reason, completely overblown charges). They do NOT log IPs by default, and if you do not comply with court orders of the country you are based in, you can close up shop.
Thank you for sounding the alarm about the untrustworthiness of this company. Keep on keeping on, my anarchist friend.
holy shit someone on lemmy made a long comment, you say
What long history of capitulation?
Well, I know there are some cases. But they are still bound by Swiss law, or soon they will not have a company anymore.
It’s not perfect on privacy, but I wouldn’t call it “capitulation” either.
Proton’s homepage has a very different take on Swiss law.
Our technology and business are based upon this fundamentally stronger definition of privacy, backed also by Swiss privacy laws.
Proton is based in Switzerland, and your data does not go to the cloud. Instead, it stays under the protection of some of the world’s strongest privacy laws.
And a very different public message about whether they would capitulate vs defending your freedom.
We are a neutral and safe haven for your personal data, committed to defending your freedom.
Well that’s actually what I said, isn’t it? Swiss law, which they have to abide by. Some of the strongest in the world, but not airtight for people who commit crimes.
The laws protect the company and the users privacy to a certain extent, but that also means Proton have the responsibility to uphold that law, or the law will be meaningless.
Getting into trouble by repeatedly purposely breaking the law is probably the easiest way for a company to get disbanded. No other companies will work with you, your server contracts will not be extended and you won’t get anything done.
And neutral is also probably a lawful type of neutral, judging from the many times they mention the law :)
Sure. Tuta is better though.
No, it isn’t.
Oh pray tell how so? Because proton not only accepts people on blacklists as deserving to be there with no way to appeal, despite you know, things. But they also removed like thousands of people that the US government said they were suspicious of they sent them a list and they suspended all their email accounts, no appeal nothing. Based on the word of the United States government, a famously untrustworthy source. I say that as United States citizen.
Because proton not only accepts people on blacklists as deserving to be there with no way to appeal, despite you know, things
You’re going to have to elaborate or rephrase this because I have no idea what you’re trying to say here
they also removed like thousands of people that the US government said they were suspicious of they sent them a list and they suspended all their email accounts, no appeal nothing. Based on the word of the United States government, a famously untrustworthy source. I say that as United States citizen.
No they didn’t.
First of all the second part was in the news just like 6 9 months ago, I might not have an entirely right but that’s generally what they did, they took the word off governments over people. Second of all I happen to know they accept blacklists as trustworthy, I know because someone who isn’t me is on one and they refused them an account.
In truth they are Israel’s bitch. In short.
I might not have an entirely right but that’s generally what they did, they took the word off governments over people
No they didn’t. Thats not “generally” what they did at all. You’re just spreading more misinformation that you admittedly aren’t even very confident about.
Second of all I happen to know they accept blacklists as trustworthy, I know because someone who isn’t me is on one and they refused them an account.
Do you have any proof of this? Or are you just going with “I heard from a guy”?
Is it this, or something else?
https://theintercept.com/2025/09/12/proton-mail-journalist-accounts-suspended/
I’ve been following this on X/Twitter and I think one of the most egregious things that’s important to point out is that folks from Phrack reached out to Proton in private multiple times, and Proton ghosted them. Proton only engaged with them and then reinstated the accounts after Phrack went public and their X/Twitter post went viral. It also looks like one of the writers filed an appeal with Proton and Proton denied the appeal, so they manually investigated the incident and refused to reinstate the account and then only did after this got attention on X/Twitter.
Because, for some reason on Lemmy, people think Proton is above criticism, and will defend the corporation’s false claims of fighting for their users when we have article after article proving the opposite
They’re not at all above criticism. The thing is all we have in the way of criticism is article after article of misinformation born from either technical ignorance or deliberate misrepresentation of the facts. None of which stand up to a moments scrutiny, much less “prove” anything.
On the more innocent side of the scale, you’ll have people chastising Proton over negatives that are entirely out of their control, and exist because they have to when operating as a public email provider. Then those same people will point people to alternatives like Fastmail or Tutanota that have all the same problems, but are less transparent about it.
Like if you want to make an argument against public email providers as a whole you can surely do so, but so far there’s really no evidence that Proton is anything but as good as you are reasonably going to get if you do decide to use one.
all we have in the way of criticism is article after article of misinformation
Ironic you made misinformation to claim this. It’s a strawman. Anyway
negatives that are entirely out of their control
No, it’s their false advertisement that claims it is within their control.
I’d like to see those “articles over articles” that do not reference the one case that is cited over and over please.
You already educated everybody here that Proton is not to be trusted when it comes to logging. What do I get out of talking to you further, my anarchist friend? If you see a couple more articles, will you make a post condemning Proton’s false advertisement?
Importantly, not to be confused with their email service’s IP logging
This AGAIN? They were ordered by a Swiss court to log the IP accessing the mailbox, (which the court granted because the French authorities cited terrorism as a reason, completely overblown charges). They do NOT log IPs by default, and if you do not comply with court orders of the country you are based in, you can close up shop.
if you do not comply with court orders of the country you are based in, you can close up shop
This is exactly the case for every VPN and network operator. Some take steps to remediate issues around anonymity, and some even offer ways to pay anonymously, but no company is going to break the law for you.
I have issues with Proton’s head being far too conciliatory to Trump, but the email thing wasn’t something they could do anything about, because it’s an inherent flaw with how email works; it was a court order to which they were compelled to comply, whether they wanted to or not.
Didn’t they also just relocate because of this ruling? I could be mistaken.
They’re moving to Germany, but it’s still ongoing
Yes, they capitulated.
I’m a little more concerned that in your rush to defend them, you seem to be implying that pushing back against the authorities should be the norm, which is way worse than what they’re doing here. Surely an anarchist [sic] can appreciate that.
It’s a reality of our world that if you don’t comply with court orders, the court will make you comply by using force. I’m no fan of that, but that’s something neither me nor any mail provider can prevent.
Also, any business has an interest in not making the cops bash in your doors on the regular; you lose any ability to make the courts side with you when you try to get better outcomes for your costumers if you are known to not comply.
If you’re not a fan of it, take your complaints to Proton.
I appreciate you sounding the alarm that Proton’s PR here is not to be trusted, but you’re acting upset at the messenger.
