Because it is, or are you of the impression that calling someone a bitch isn’t an insult? Seems to me it’s still a pejorative, same with all the other ‘reappropriated’ words except for the n-word (contextually, I’ve heard black people use it as an insult too so go ahead and figure that one out for me).
There’s not much to figure out. If I use a certain tone, the word “queer” will still be used as pejorative, even if it’s mostly not these days. It sounds like you don’t really understand what you are complaining about, unless you have more to say to make your point?
Stick to your initial claim, realise you made a overly broad statement, acknowledge it and move the hell on with your life. You’re not married to the fuckin’ comment, it’s not a ride or die.
If you speak to someone who has not reappropriated the word, yeah, they could be angry. But remember your point was that reappropriation is bullshit. Is it true that something is bullshit when it clearly works, but there are exceptions? It would be like saying feminism is bullshit because there are still gender inequalities.
Right now you just said “my point was never anything but perception of the words having not be changed”, but we showed you it definitely changed, in a lot of situations, for a lot of people.
Are you instead saying that the words haven’t entirely changed meaning for everybody, everywhere, in all contexts? Because then, it’s not really a good point. You can’t expect any cultural progress to work completely, there are people that will keep the old mentalities or not be updated for a while.
Then you haven’t been paying attention for the last 30+ years. “We’re here, we’re queer, get used to it” has been an activist chant since the 90s, started by a group called Queer Nation. The Q in LGBTQ+ stands for queer. If you were involved with the queer community, you would know that it is used as a self-identifier for any non-heteronormative person regularly these days.
If they’re a non-hetero person and you use it casually, I highly doubt they’ll give a shit. If you use it like a pejorative, then is one. Like the word “Jew”. That’s the common word for those in that religion/ethnicity and very often used to self identify. But in certain contexts with certain intonation, it’s understood to be a slur. The N word is less polite even among black people, but it’s still a common word used to self identify for those in the black community, but is still very much a slur when used by those outside the community. Calling someone a genius can be a compliment, or an insult depending on context. Both can be true.
Maybe you live somewhere rural or something, I literally never heard it said as a pejorative except in movies, and I hear it plenty. People quite literally identify as queer around me, it’s a shining example of reappropriation working. People not getting with the program doesn’t mean the program isn’t working. For example, a lot of people don’t understand basic logical reasoning despite having been to school for a long time. It doesn’t mean school is new age bullshit.
Also, the word “tone” is polysemous. Maybe you didn’t know, but it makes me think I’m taking the troll bait?
Look, I understand that there’s this mentality that taking words back is empowering. What I disagree with, entirely, is that the perception of the word has changed.
You call random men on the street queers or bitches, you better hope they aren’t a former inmate.
Listen, I understand that there’s this mentality that taking words back is somehow empowering. My counterpoint is that there’s a considerable number of men, at least where I live, who would take being called queer as an insult. They’d definitely take being called bitch as an insult, shit dude — maybe you’ve never met someone who went into prison but you do not call them a bitch. You’re likely to get the shit kicked out of you.
Why would reappropriation be bullshit? And how is it new age?
Because it is, or are you of the impression that calling someone a bitch isn’t an insult? Seems to me it’s still a pejorative, same with all the other ‘reappropriated’ words except for the n-word (contextually, I’ve heard black people use it as an insult too so go ahead and figure that one out for me).
There’s not much to figure out. If I use a certain tone, the word “queer” will still be used as pejorative, even if it’s mostly not these days. It sounds like you don’t really understand what you are complaining about, unless you have more to say to make your point?
The English language is not a tonal language, and it’s interesting that you bring it up — because I have only heard queer used as a pejorative.
Reappropriation does not work.
Never heard we’re here, we’re queer! Get used to it!
Never heard of Queer eye for the straight guy?
Never heard of Queer Nation?
Hmmm.
Dude, Idk what to tell you — call random men queer and see what happens.
You’re shifting the goalposts. poor move.
Stick to your initial claim, realise you made a overly broad statement, acknowledge it and move the hell on with your life. You’re not married to the fuckin’ comment, it’s not a ride or die.
No, my point was never anything but perception of the words having not be changed.
You can change the context to a positive one, it still won’t be received positively by nearly as many people as you all claim.
If you speak to someone who has not reappropriated the word, yeah, they could be angry. But remember your point was that reappropriation is bullshit. Is it true that something is bullshit when it clearly works, but there are exceptions? It would be like saying feminism is bullshit because there are still gender inequalities.
Right now you just said “my point was never anything but perception of the words having not be changed”, but we showed you it definitely changed, in a lot of situations, for a lot of people.
Are you instead saying that the words haven’t entirely changed meaning for everybody, everywhere, in all contexts? Because then, it’s not really a good point. You can’t expect any cultural progress to work completely, there are people that will keep the old mentalities or not be updated for a while.
Then you haven’t been paying attention for the last 30+ years. “We’re here, we’re queer, get used to it” has been an activist chant since the 90s, started by a group called Queer Nation. The Q in LGBTQ+ stands for queer. If you were involved with the queer community, you would know that it is used as a self-identifier for any non-heteronormative person regularly these days.
No I’ve heard the chant, what I disagree with is that it’s actually had an effect on how the word is perceived.
For example, call a former inmate a bitch or a queer. Hell, call random men bitches or queers. Examine the results.
If they’re a non-hetero person and you use it casually, I highly doubt they’ll give a shit. If you use it like a pejorative, then is one. Like the word “Jew”. That’s the common word for those in that religion/ethnicity and very often used to self identify. But in certain contexts with certain intonation, it’s understood to be a slur. The N word is less polite even among black people, but it’s still a common word used to self identify for those in the black community, but is still very much a slur when used by those outside the community. Calling someone a genius can be a compliment, or an insult depending on context. Both can be true.
No I’m pretty sure you can apply a positive context to your use of the word and there are people who will still flip out at you about it.
I don’t really care, there are certain things I can’t stop — performative activism is one of them.
Maybe you live somewhere rural or something, I literally never heard it said as a pejorative except in movies, and I hear it plenty. People quite literally identify as queer around me, it’s a shining example of reappropriation working. People not getting with the program doesn’t mean the program isn’t working. For example, a lot of people don’t understand basic logical reasoning despite having been to school for a long time. It doesn’t mean school is new age bullshit.
Also, the word “tone” is polysemous. Maybe you didn’t know, but it makes me think I’m taking the troll bait?
Look, I understand that there’s this mentality that taking words back is empowering. What I disagree with, entirely, is that the perception of the word has changed.
You call random men on the street queers or bitches, you better hope they aren’t a former inmate.
Bud, i’m Queer. Got some big ol’ history about taking weapons from those who would oppress us and turning them into windchimes my friend…
Listen, I understand that there’s this mentality that taking words back is somehow empowering. My counterpoint is that there’s a considerable number of men, at least where I live, who would take being called queer as an insult. They’d definitely take being called bitch as an insult, shit dude — maybe you’ve never met someone who went into prison but you do not call them a bitch. You’re likely to get the shit kicked out of you.
Mate. Buddy. Champ. These words will also get the shit kicked out of you.
Context.