Democrats are trading long term consequences for short term ones. Prolonged government shut down could do those you mentioned, but since Lemmy love the trolley problem so much, need I remind that those are short term pains compared to enabling fascism to take over later down the line? Because when have fascists ever let go of power? And I’m talking about the state of the US government now, not during Biden’s term. Democrats caving in in the previous shutdown doesn’t even look genuine. The Democratic politicians who voted with Republicans just so happened that their terms won’t be up soon, or are about to retire anyway.
Just look at other countries and the opposition parties do their job as opposition, namely in South Korea and Brazil. They are punishing insurrectionists who tried to subvert democracy. I find that Americans are sedated and still wondering if they are in fascism or not.
need I remind that those are short term pains compared to enabling fascism to take over later down the line?
These actions don’t make fascism less likely though.
Fascism thrives on emergencies and suffering, taking away food and medical from millions would do this effectively.
Even worse, if the Democrats messed with the debt ceiling it would fundamentally cripple any future non fascist government’s ability to fix problems.
Good idea, look at South Korea and Brazil. They have been able to do things because the of popular legislation and/or the judiciary, not because a minority party obstructed normal legislation. That’s the exact opposite of what you are proposing. What those examples demonstrate is the importance of winning elections, not about causing havoc as the opposition party.
The then South Korean opposition wasn’t in power at the time, and yet they spearheaded the impeachment and eventual arrest and prosecution of their previous wannabe dictator, who insurrected a coup to prevent him being impeached. Brazil got lucky that their Brazilian Supreme Court was found to be corrupt and aligned with the previous authoritarian Bolsonaro, which led to the replacement of the judges. The new judges along with the other branches of government and opposition prosecuted Bolsonaro.
Brazil and SK opposition prosecuted their dictators to the fullest authority of their laws. The US? They’re spineless. Even after Trump’s insurrection and after Biden took power, all the US branches failed to prosecute Trump and the Democrats did not hold him accountable. He regained power as a result.
The truth isn’t about who holds the seats, it’s whether or not politicians and bureaucrats have the political will. The American population have been conditioned to stick to “decorum”, even though the opponent is playing dirty and not playing by the rules. The difference is that Brazil and South Korea experienced dictatorship so they know to call a spade-- a spade. The US, hasn’t experienced dictatorship, and to be blunt, after exporting to other nations; and couldn’t tell that it’s dictatorship after throwing it and returned to the hand that threw.
it’s whether or not politicians and bureaucrats have the political will.
That and the institutions, but sure. So, why on Earth would you think that the Dems threatening to hurt American citizens will somehow change the political will/calculus?
“Those Dems are holding the government hostage… I should probably reconsider my position on trump!”
Democrats are trading long term consequences for short term ones. Prolonged government shut down could do those you mentioned, but since Lemmy love the trolley problem so much, need I remind that those are short term pains compared to enabling fascism to take over later down the line? Because when have fascists ever let go of power? And I’m talking about the state of the US government now, not during Biden’s term. Democrats caving in in the previous shutdown doesn’t even look genuine. The Democratic politicians who voted with Republicans just so happened that their terms won’t be up soon, or are about to retire anyway.
Just look at other countries and the opposition parties do their job as opposition, namely in South Korea and Brazil. They are punishing insurrectionists who tried to subvert democracy. I find that Americans are sedated and still wondering if they are in fascism or not.
These actions don’t make fascism less likely though.
Fascism thrives on emergencies and suffering, taking away food and medical from millions would do this effectively.
Even worse, if the Democrats messed with the debt ceiling it would fundamentally cripple any future non fascist government’s ability to fix problems.
Good idea, look at South Korea and Brazil. They have been able to do things because the of popular legislation and/or the judiciary, not because a minority party obstructed normal legislation. That’s the exact opposite of what you are proposing. What those examples demonstrate is the importance of winning elections, not about causing havoc as the opposition party.
The then South Korean opposition wasn’t in power at the time, and yet they spearheaded the impeachment and eventual arrest and prosecution of their previous wannabe dictator, who insurrected a coup to prevent him being impeached. Brazil got lucky that their Brazilian Supreme Court was found to be corrupt and aligned with the previous authoritarian Bolsonaro, which led to the replacement of the judges. The new judges along with the other branches of government and opposition prosecuted Bolsonaro.
Brazil and SK opposition prosecuted their dictators to the fullest authority of their laws. The US? They’re spineless. Even after Trump’s insurrection and after Biden took power, all the US branches failed to prosecute Trump and the Democrats did not hold him accountable. He regained power as a result.
The truth isn’t about who holds the seats, it’s whether or not politicians and bureaucrats have the political will. The American population have been conditioned to stick to “decorum”, even though the opponent is playing dirty and not playing by the rules. The difference is that Brazil and South Korea experienced dictatorship so they know to call a spade-- a spade. The US, hasn’t experienced dictatorship, and to be blunt, after exporting to other nations; and couldn’t tell that it’s dictatorship after throwing it and returned to the hand that threw.
That and the institutions, but sure. So, why on Earth would you think that the Dems threatening to hurt American citizens will somehow change the political will/calculus?
“Those Dems are holding the government hostage… I should probably reconsider my position on trump!”