If voting didn’t matter they wouldnt be working so hard to rat fuck the elections.
Not really true. Since voting in a capitalist dictatorship makes people have faith in their current system, threatening (and trying) to take it away lets people retreat to a position that capitalists also ultimately approve of and control. Its similar to candidate stacking: if both choices are pro-capitalist, then its strategically beneficial.
Would they rather eliminate voting entirely? Not really, because voting as a rigged game has proven its usefulness historically by giving people the illusion of choice, being a useful spectacle / popularity contest, and building faith in the system. Its really useful in preventing the alternative: which is worker’s taking power, and its why all working class states aim to overthrow bourgeios democracy.
Bourgeois democracy is a completely rigged game, and has proven the safest and most reliable shell for capitalist rule, regardless of voting methods or form, whether its in the US, UK, Japan, South Korea, Germany, Australia, etc.
Because the only thing both Democrats and Republicans care about is the color of the trolley.
Hey remember when Trump broke up that rail strike? Hey remember when Trump was claiming he was doing everything he could to stop Israel from committing a genocide, but then it was leaked he wasn’t doing anything? Hey remember when Trump sicced the police on student protesters? Remember in 2020 when Trump had the federal police disappear people in black vans? Hey remember when Trump promised to pay out covid relief and then he didnt pay out the amount hed promised? Remember when he declared covid was over, despite the fact it was (and is) still infecting 1000’s? Remember he promised to cure cancer? Remember how Trump lied about not having cancer? Remember when Trump killed MeToo due to credible allegations of sexual assault? Remember how Trump lied about his mental state? Remember when Trumps son was embroiled in a massive corruption scandal in Ukraine?Hey remember when Trump campaigned on harm reduction and then he increased the police budget drastically? Hey remember when he bragged he was tougher on immigration than his first term?
Anyway remember voting is super important, its your democratic duty and the best tool we have for changing the system, which is why its completely idiotic to vote for any third party, its a complete waste of a vote that does nothing, your vote is worthless and meaningless so you have to vote for the democrats you have to vote for the democrats you have to vote for the democrats its the only way we can change things by continuing to vote for democrats you must continue to vote for democrats this strategy will surely work this time its the most important election of our lifetime and this is pragmatic
A trolley is close enough to a train lmao.
People have already forgotten Biden was the same fiddle for Beni’s genocide that Trump is and that Kamala cheer3d we’d have the most deadly military in the world.
Brain dead.
Remember when Biden broke the rail strike?
Yet so many still defend him for doing it
amtrak joe!
Yes true but the red trolley someone will hang out the window and shoot you. The blue trolley will just keep trucking.
Biden and Harris bragged about being tougher on immigration than Trump. They started and escalated the current state of Palestinian genocide. Biden had cops arrest protesters.
The difference between the two trolleys is that, as long as its red, then liberals are capable of acknowledging the trolley is bad.
Funny how you don’t deny that the red one will shoot me. You just agreed with the meme that things stay the same. As I agree things stay the same. But the red one is most is more willing to hurt me.
The difference between the two trolleys is that, as long as its red, then liberals are capable of acknowledging the trolley is bad.
Funny how your eyes glazed over the part where I made it clear there’s no difference. Are you dense or something?
Incidentally, every thing the red one does gets normalised by the blue one. “Tough on crime”, “tough on immigration”, “tax cuts for the wealthy”, “insider trading”, “being an insane warmonger”, “being unfit for the office”, “the climate”, these things used to be stuff that was the reason why we *had * to vote blue. Now they’re things that you shouldnt talk about lest the red team wins. The last thing that made it the most important election was genocide and not even that was a red line, so now even genocide is just something you have to accept. Seems like a great strategy to continue voting for the people that shoot at you. I guess you have to, it is the most important election in our lifetime after all.
I’m curious what’s the goal of not voting? What’s your goal? If I don’t vote red wins if I do vote blue wins and by what you say everything stays the same. So what’s the point if it other than saying. I’m bad and dumb. Maybe I am?
Im curious, whats the goal of continuing to vote for a party that shows no regard to any of your interests?
Whats the point in loudly declaring “Even though you do fuck all to curtail climate change; you keep expanding the fascist surveillance state; you bomb whoever you want and shit out money for all your friends while hunting down homeless people and immigrants for sport; you do nothing to fight for the rights of women, queer people and other marginalised groups; even though you frequently sabotage orgs like ACORN - to your own detriment - and do other stuff to further erode the vague notion of governmental institutions we have left; even though you’re committing genocide and actively working against any progressive initiative; even though Donald Trump was literally propelled in the media due to YOUR Pied Piper strategy; well, I’ll still unconditionally vote for you. This is, after all, the most important election and there’s a dang cheeto in the white house. Or a bush. Or a Reagan or a Nixon or whoever else. And hey, if you win the election but then get ratfucked, I’ll cheer you on when you throw your hands in the air and do nothing about it! Gotta remain civil! Can’t in any way threaten you dear blue dogs, that might make it harder for you to get elected and this is the most important election in our lifetimes! You do not have to win my vote!”To me it seems like further entrenching a political elite into a position of “Holy shit we can do anything we want with no repercussions, let’s give another trillion dollars to Israel, pass out more fracking initiatives, foment some more coups and give more money to cops, theres clearly no reason not to!” is a terrible strategy, and it seems like my analysis is supported by the clear depreciation of political standards in the US. Every election more red lines get crossed and it does not matter.
There was once a time when it would matter if a politician was so obviously corrupt as the dem leadership is. Writing the crime bill would once have barred you from office. Or being aremoved. There was a brief window where passing out massive fracking contracts or mindlessly giving even more money to the police would have been something that you couldnt just do. Now dems are cheering on a modern Holocaust and it does not matter because you gotta vote blue! They’re slightly nicer on camera!Seems like continuing to vote for democrats have only had the effect of giving more power to out of touch ghouls. Seems like this strategy has proven not to work for quite a while, so maybe, just maybe, it might be worth it to do something else.
Personally I’d recommend you vote for PSL, I do not get why you think “dont vote for democrats” somehow means “dont vote”. But if the alternative to not voting blue is not voting for you, then it would be better if you didnt vote.
In other words: Whats the point in voting for the murdertrolley?
Doesn’t this whole post limply that voting doesn’t matter. Now all of a sudden you say I should vote? I should just vote for the people you say or maybe I should vote for the person who most represents my values. And I do do that, well the lesser of 2 evils. I know the 2 party system sucks. And I’ll vote for 3rd party when I can but I also know voting 3rd party often means a vote taken away from my 2nd choice. So I’ll vote how I see fit which it sounds like what you’re saying to do.
There is nothing lesser about the evil of a party committing genocide unless you consider their victims to be lesser.
The post makes it clear that there is no difference between voting democrat or republican. Why are you being obtuse?
Furthermore, before I answer more of your half-brained questions, answer mine.
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If you had to pick one, who would you say is more responsible for encouraging voter apathy: The Democratic party for openly becoming Bush-era Republicans and then doing a genocide, or lemmy dot ml for pointing it out?
The issue is that we can’t just stop after voting. We have to push the parties to become more like what we need.
Nope, there is another alternative: revolution and working class power. Many countries went through this extremely difficult struggle to liberate themselves from capitalist/imperialist domination.
Too much suffering that way, for everyone.
How well did that work with Joey B?
Who? Sorry can’t remember, too busy thinking about the upcoming election, which I’m told will be the Most Important Election Of Our Lifetimes
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Make sure to vote extra hard against genocide this time, I’m sure it will make a difference!
“Genocide is not on the ballot!”
LOL
Don’t forget that it’s definitely THE most important election in your lifetime; a true battle for the soul of the nation™! So get out there and
so we can go back to brunch!New to Lemmy. Is this common from this instance?
I’m no fan of the dem elite, but I’m still a believer that if we’re OK with incremental change and we’re active at all levels of government that we can motivate others to re-engage and take back what’s ours. That doesn’t mean that we wait till we can vote again and try better next time, it means we start creating the society we want to exist. Building up local politicians, and supporting the hell out of places that support us, hell, even supporting the hell out of places that aren’t supporting us right now but have the structure to support us.
Ugh, no. Death to America.
Unless you’re going to kill America before the next election, you should still be voting for harm reduction.
I don’t get a vote, lol. My country will probably be invaded by America before the next election.
Harm reduction would be Amerika suffering harder. (Because there’s a world outside that genocidal empire country FYI)
For me it’s hard to believe how a sane Person can think that Trump isn’t a human desaster compared to any other president in the last decades. And with him the entire party and big parts of the population just went crazy.
Trump didn’t appear out of thin air. He is the culmination of US history. Every milquetoast democrat we have elected helped to prepare us for Trump. When Obama refused to prosecute the war-criminals of the Bush regime, and in fact expanded the illegal assassination program, he was a forerunner of Trump. If your only standard is “blue”, then you have surrendered any political agency. You are a political non-entity. No one needs court your vote, for it is granted. You guarantee the capitalist agenda with your acquiescence to its illusory constraints.
Trump is the most incompetent administrator and propagandist to have ever held the figurehead.
That doesn’t mean “his” agenda is novel or even has anything to do with him.
The agenda is giving finance capital control over all resources in the world, and has been obediently followed by every president since the fall of the USSR.
That’s because, unlike you, those people consider foreigners to be human.
Succinct
it’s always the most important election of all times, amirite.
Just 1 more election bro, trust me. Just 1 more, we have to have a qualified president like girlboss Kamala who 👏 would 👏 bomb 👏 children 👏 the 👏 right 👏 way!
We’ll eventually get to shift left and do meaningful progression but first we have win! (and keep winning for multiple elections in a row surely to keep our momentum otherwise it’ll all be reverted)
The blue trolley moves a bit slower, and that’s something.
Slower is not a good thing here. US democrats have been in general more competent managers of the US empire, care more about its image internationally, and think more long term.
The fall of the US empire (especially the closing of its 900+ military bases internationally) would bring the greatest benefit to the world, and help resolve one of the greatest contradictions in the world today: inequality between rich and poor countries.
The blue trolley does not move slower, I’d say it accelerates more slowly than when it’s blue than red. The train never slows down.
That’s a lot of words to say move slower. If the train accelerates at rate R when it’s red, and rate B when it’s blue, and B < R, the trim is slower when it’s blue that red.
Same policies, different jerk.
Only if you don’t see the people outside the US empire as people.
i think it’s quid pro quo now. Seppos stopped being people down here when they started being fascists.
To those who live within the empire.
I don’t think Harris would be at war with Iran right now. Never said it’s good, but a slower train is easier to stop and runs over fewer people in the interim. It’s objectively better. Not good, better.
I think she would be, with her most lethal military ever!
I don’t think Harris would be at war with Iran right now.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/10/8/kamala-harris-says-iran-is-greatest-adversary-of-us
Not to mention the sanctions against Iran that preceded the war. But hey, as long as you get your treats right? The difference with red and blue is that blue might give you some!
Wow amazing, killing people but slower is better. It’s in fact the best we can have and there’s nothing else to do.
How about fucking dismantling that damn train? Blow it up? Replace it and the entire system instead of insisting on using the “Global South-Mower”?
Wow amazing, killing people but slower is better
Objectively true
It’s in fact the best we can have and there’s nothing else to do.
Not even remotely close to what I said
How about fucking dismantling that damn train?
If you can figure out a way to dismantle the train without opening the door to a train that’s just as bad if not worse, I’m all ears
How about fucking dismantling that damn train? Blow it up? Replace it and the entire system instead of insisting on using the “Global South-Mower”?
Okay, go ahead.
What? You don’t want to do that yourself? You want me to do it and get myself killed?
What? You don’t want to do that yourself? You want me to do it and get myself killed?
Every fucking time with Amerikans. You are all so self-absorbed that you end up saying this every time. I am not even telling you to commit to adventurism but to organize for a revolution.
Think you can just guilt-trip while you insist on the election that kills far more people that you don’t consider to be humans just so you can keep having treats from BlueMAGA? Fuck off.
Every time we tell them to organize in their community, they pretend we told them to banzai charge a national guard armory by themselves with a sharpened toothbrush. Fucking anything but engaging with what’s actually being said to them.
Neither you nor I have to do it because it’s going to be forced upon us as Americans’ material living conditions continue to worsen.
The difference is that if we do it ourselves it’ll be a lot less traumatic and violent that it will be if it’s forced upon us.
As an immigrant: go fuck yourself
Fuck me yourself, coward.
As someone outside the US empire: how about you go fuck yourself instead.
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If you’re from outside the US, then what’s your stake in this?
I don’t know maybe the fact that the us is a giant murderous empire that kills thousands(+) every year through direct military action and indirectly through financial warfare and has destroyed multiple countries? Really confirming Americans don’t see people outside euroamerika as human.
I was talking to the fuckface saying that both parties are equivalent
Which party destroyed Libya? Which party oversaw and supported the beginning of this current escalation to overt genocide in Palestine? Which party filled Serbia with depleted uranium that continues to have negative effects in health outcomes to this day? Which party oversaw the drone strikes on weddings and innocents in Yemen and across the middle east?
I could keep going and also talk about the bi-partisan enforcement of sanctions that kill thousands(+) every year, or the backsites like Guantanamo that continue to run under both parties and so on.
Ok, then why is it better not to vote? Or are you saying it’s better to vote republican?
Which action, in regards to voting, improves this situation?
Voting or not voting in America is irrelevant one is not better than the other. Your vote means nothing you have a uniparty that works for the interest of a ruling class to which they have given 2 names. I often wish Americans would remember how change was truly affected by groups like the Suffragettes, and those that made up movements like the labour movements and civil rights movement etc (hint: it wasn’t by voting for 99.9% Hitler). If they would start seeing people outside euroamerika as equal humans that would be nice too but I can only live and hope.
If both are equivalent, then why did you ask me to go fuck myself?
Voting and not voting are equally meaningless actions, pushing voting as something important and the democrats as something to strive for is bullshit that only serves to obscure reality and help perpetuate the status quo that is built on the mass exploitation and murder of those of us outside the empire.
We are begging you to overthrow your government. Stop removed on the internet about red VS blue.
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I misspoke. It wouldn’t be in midlogs, because a user deleted it. Thanks for that though, I’m glad you’re not busy.
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Hahaha!
is this sarcasm?
Edit: their comment was just calling me an “expendable”, and they pretty much admitted farther down that they’re a bigot and they meant it.
No, they (me) didn’t.
Fucking preferred the nothing of the blue guy tyvm. Was he perfect, hell no, would I rather have him at the helm now? Yes please.
Every other person in the world would rather an incomoent nincompoop be at the helm, so that you get a taste of the death and destruction you’ve wrought onto the rest of the world for 80 years. Good luck!
the nothing of the blue guy
(*this stage of) The Palestinian genocide began under the blue guy
It began in the 1940s.
The meme doesn’t mention Biden, who wasn’t even on the ticket, because the DNC undemocratically shoved Harris down your throat.
💦💦
Your daily reminder that BlueMaga liberals don’t consider non-westeners to be human. That’s why they can describe active genocide as “nothing” and “not perfect”
this is only relevant for gringos, the rest of the people like me in the world keep getting fucked. i don’t give two fucks about your blue/redmaga bullshit. i want your country to stop being a fascist empire.
Then maybe stop mocking the institutes that have more chance at changing things than assuring people voting doesn’t matter, only contributing to the problem in the long-term.
The tools and mechanisms of democracy may be faulty and not work 100% of the time, less so in some places, but it is worse without them.
Even if they don’t matter, truly, for some time, people taking part in the ritual stay way more politically active as opposed to not doing even as little. This makes them more likely to continue, like maybe rally or contact their representatives or maybe get more people involved. None of this is perfect or guaranteed, but the alternative is letting the more politically active opponent win.
I myself live in a place where voting means more than people actually realize, but still think very little of it, only making it easier for the status quo to prevail through lies, propaganda and rigging, because if nobody voted, then nobody feels as screwed over, and that energy doesn’t flow in the way that may actually have some positive change.
You may not believe in voting or take part, but at least don’t be discouraging people from as little. Especially if you believe in something more immediate and reactionary - that just can’t come from nowhere, certainly not from “Nothing I do will ever matter”.
Ew, dude.
the United States is also a one-party state but, with typical American extravagance, they have two of them.
— Julius NyerereI shall not go to the polls. I have not registered. I believe that democracy has so far disappeared in the United States that no “two evils” exist. There is but one evil party with two names, and it will be elected despite all I can do or say…
— W.E.B. Du Bois
half of the things you said don’t apply to me because i live in your backyard, amigo. i’m not telling anyone to not be political, i’m saying they should stop pretending they live in democracy because you dont. you’re one step away from feudalism. be political, organize, read, help union shit, join the communist party. but stop pretending McWhite is going to not be bought by capital. there is no, there will never be an ounce of democracy in the filthy states of america, until it collapses and is rebuilt.
Yeah. Staging wars isn’t a trumpesce innovation, he is just quite an klotz about it. Hope no klotz takes offense.
