Of course but I meant that it’s naive to expect it to go back to normal without substantial strife for the people who live here not downplaying any strife elsewhere.
The Republicans are going to fuck up badly enough that they doom themselves in fair elections leaving them openly cheating or otherwise ending actual democracy. This leads to resistance and upset which they meet with violence which cycles up until the whole thing explodes.
Of course but I meant that it’s naive to expect it to go back to normal without substantial strife for the people who live here not downplaying any strife elsewhere.
Well that “normal” people want to go back to already included massive strife for the rest of the world, so I’m not sympathetic to Americans.
otherwise ending actual democracy.
I find it hard to say that’s there’s much Democracy to end anyway.
This leads to resistance and upset which they meet with violence which cycles up until the whole thing explodes.
Yeah. That’s the Imperial Boomerang for you, I suppose.
Actual democracy means that if you don’t like how its going you have a right to switch leadership which in turn has a right to change the laws you don’t like something we absolutely have had.before just recently.
Did the millions of people America murdered overseas have a right to switch leadership? Or the absurd number of prisoners in US jails? Did people outside of swing states? People who want something other than neoliberalism? The people who were part of communist or black liberation parties that were destroyed by the US intelligence services and their leadership assassinated?
Obviously people in other countries don’t have a right to have a say in leadership here. All the people mentioned here have exactly the rights others have to vote. Obviously the relatively stupid beta democracy 0.03 we are stuck with doesn’t provide very good protection nor ability to achieve even reasonable ends in our rather fucky system but that wasn’t really the question.
The question is given large scale fuckery are we able to change gears. We were up until now it looks like we won’t be able to going forward which is a substantial difference.
Obviously people in other countries don’t have a right to have a say in leadership here.
Why is “obvious” that people having their countries destroyed and their families murdered by the US government shouldn’t be allowed to have a say in it? This sounds like white supremacism, frankly.
All the people mentioned here have exactly the rights others have to vote.
So you’re just abandoning your original claim. You’re also just straight up wrong, by the way, not all of those people have the right to vote. Especially the ones who were murdered by the state.
Obviously the relatively stupid beta democracy 0.03
So what’s the line between “stupid beta democracy” and just not being a democracy?
We were up until now
No you fucking weren’t, what?
we won’t be able to going forward which is a substantial difference.
Why is “obvious” that people having their countries destroyed and their families murdered by the US government shouldn’t be allowed to have a say in it? This sounds like white supremacism, frankly.
It is pretty obvious insofar as every democracy in history has been a democracy of the it’s members by which they determine it’s leadership and therefore its direction. It’s not clear how or why anyone would allow other nations citizens a vote both logistically and reasonably since other nations are going to have motivations and aims which are directly opposed to ours. Absent an overarching government in which everyone is a member it makes little sense and would destroy any notion of self determination.
So you’re just abandoning your original claim.
The original claim was that it was going to get a lot worse before it gets better because historically every other country that gave into a populist fascist regime had a period of grave strife before it returning to democracy herein defined as it has been traditionally as the people getting to choose their leadership and thus their direction. You are the one that turned it into me continually explaining basic shit to you like why Chinese people can’t vote to pick the representative of California.
The assertion after that became more broadly that prior to 2021 we had a democracy. Not a good one but one in which we could throw the leadership out if they fucked up enough and pick new folks. In 2021 they lost and tried to take over. Now they are back and entirely off prior rails. They are making destructive choices that are going to lead to them losing any fair contest by 2028 and are based entirely on prior behavior and statements by self not going to give up power. It is going to get very very bad.
Most places which fall to fascist regimes have a minimum of a few decades of bad times and thousands to millions of deaths.
Well the US has already thoroughly managed the millions dead, assuming you consider foreigners human.
Of course but I meant that it’s naive to expect it to go back to normal without substantial strife for the people who live here not downplaying any strife elsewhere.
The Republicans are going to fuck up badly enough that they doom themselves in fair elections leaving them openly cheating or otherwise ending actual democracy. This leads to resistance and upset which they meet with violence which cycles up until the whole thing explodes.
Well that “normal” people want to go back to already included massive strife for the rest of the world, so I’m not sympathetic to Americans.
I find it hard to say that’s there’s much Democracy to end anyway.
Yeah. That’s the Imperial Boomerang for you, I suppose.
Actual democracy means that if you don’t like how its going you have a right to switch leadership which in turn has a right to change the laws you don’t like something we absolutely have had.before just recently.
Did the millions of people America murdered overseas have a right to switch leadership? Or the absurd number of prisoners in US jails? Did people outside of swing states? People who want something other than neoliberalism? The people who were part of communist or black liberation parties that were destroyed by the US intelligence services and their leadership assassinated?
Obviously people in other countries don’t have a right to have a say in leadership here. All the people mentioned here have exactly the rights others have to vote. Obviously the relatively stupid beta democracy 0.03 we are stuck with doesn’t provide very good protection nor ability to achieve even reasonable ends in our rather fucky system but that wasn’t really the question.
The question is given large scale fuckery are we able to change gears. We were up until now it looks like we won’t be able to going forward which is a substantial difference.
Why is “obvious” that people having their countries destroyed and their families murdered by the US government shouldn’t be allowed to have a say in it? This sounds like white supremacism, frankly.
So you’re just abandoning your original claim. You’re also just straight up wrong, by the way, not all of those people have the right to vote. Especially the ones who were murdered by the state.
So what’s the line between “stupid beta democracy” and just not being a democracy?
No you fucking weren’t, what?
How is that substantially different from now?
It is pretty obvious insofar as every democracy in history has been a democracy of the it’s members by which they determine it’s leadership and therefore its direction. It’s not clear how or why anyone would allow other nations citizens a vote both logistically and reasonably since other nations are going to have motivations and aims which are directly opposed to ours. Absent an overarching government in which everyone is a member it makes little sense and would destroy any notion of self determination.
The original claim was that it was going to get a lot worse before it gets better because historically every other country that gave into a populist fascist regime had a period of grave strife before it returning to democracy herein defined as it has been traditionally as the people getting to choose their leadership and thus their direction. You are the one that turned it into me continually explaining basic shit to you like why Chinese people can’t vote to pick the representative of California.
The assertion after that became more broadly that prior to 2021 we had a democracy. Not a good one but one in which we could throw the leadership out if they fucked up enough and pick new folks. In 2021 they lost and tried to take over. Now they are back and entirely off prior rails. They are making destructive choices that are going to lead to them losing any fair contest by 2028 and are based entirely on prior behavior and statements by self not going to give up power. It is going to get very very bad.