You know what, I’ll gladly admit I did not bring enough specific receipts and I’m talking in broad terms (although I provided plenty of examples to support my point). My comment was also not about the interview in question. I agree: “assertions are not evidence”. That’s why I brought you some examples which you discounted or simply ignored. You don’t have to watch Hasan’s stream all day to see the difference in social impact he has against the tide that is the right wing media apparatus, because at the end of the day, and this is my main claim: Hasan is not interested in outcomes (except the one that generate revenue).
The point about him not understanding the Western Wall is not central to the claim that it discounts everything he says. It’s central to the claim that his stream is superficial slop content meant to generate views. I don’t know why this is so hard to grasp. If you’ve been covering Israel / Gaza for over two years and you still don’t know what the Western Wall is…That’s weird. It tells me you have no interest in covering this beyond an extremely superficial level. It’s Kony 2012 all over again.
I am making claims that would require you to verify them by consuming his content. I’ve been familiar with his content for over five years. I don’t need to watch his stream any more. I look at the sum total of his outcomes. What has he managed to achieve politically so far? What is he doing to build the movement up? He doesn’t seem to care. Why should I?
I don’t know why this is so hard to grasp. If you’ve been covering Israel / Gaza for over two years and you still don’t know what the Western Wall is…That’s weird. It tells me you have no interest in covering this beyond an extremely superficial level.
It’s only strange if you give weight to the specific religious claims to Jerusalem rather than the humanity of the people living there. The archeological significance of that wall doesn’t change the politics of Zionism or Palestinian liberation, nor should it.
It would be like complaining that someone doesn’t know the significance of the Black Stone in the Kaaba while discussing the geopolitical influence of Saudi Arabia at the UN. Is it a significant part of the mythology of Islam and the region broadly? Sure. Is it relevant to the actions taken by the Saudi government today? Uhhh, not really, no.
Sure. But you should at minimum know about it. You don’t have to talk about it every day. But if you professed to be an expert in Saudi geopolitics and you didn’t know what the Kaaba is then I really don’t see any reason to listen to you any longer. It’s getting ridiculous at this point
You know what, I’ll gladly admit I did not bring enough specific receipts and I’m talking in broad terms (although I provided plenty of examples to support my point).
…
That’s why I brought you some examples which you discounted or simply ignored.
You’re “examples”, paraphrased:
He doesn’t know the significance of the Western Wall
He called an Israeli that wasn’t a settler or IDF and called for “peace and a ceasefire” a Nazi
Am I missing any?
I don’t know much about the significance or controversy of the Western Wall. It’s where politicians get photos taken when they want to demonstrate their Zionism. I don’t see the open air prison that is Gaza, or it’s destruction, or the Settlements in the West Bank being directly related to the Western Wall.
I don’t know anything about the interview or the guys comments on this allegedly reasonable, peaceful Israeli. Maybe he just decided a week before the interview that enough is enough. Maybe he is perfectly fine with the situation in the West Bank and the open air prison of Gaza, he just wants to stop worrying about the geopolitics of the conflict and his own safety. I don’t know because you did nothing but make assertions.
Your points, paraphrased:
He just reads Twitter
His content is just slop
He doesn’t care, he just wants money
He doesn’t just reads Twitter. He’s been on TV, He’s been in debates (literally was scheduled to debate Kirk in like a week or two as per this interview). I’ve seen him visiting other political programs. I’m not a fan but it’s obvious he does more than Twitter.
The content I’ve described above is more than slop. He allegedly averages 49 hours a week. A lot of that is going to be trash and low effort. It’s not all he seems to do.
Does he run ads for his own products, like the other grifters? Does he shift his position to maximize viewership or is he principled? I have seen and products (though I don’t really follow) and he has seemed pretty principled. Does he make money? Yes, he’s the largest streamer/influencer on the left. I’ve heard him called the Joe Rogan of the left and that we need of him. While I think that is a ignorant simplification and a bad metaphor, it sounds like he’s at least not just feeding rage bait and slop the entire time.
What has he managed to achieve politically so far? What is he doing to build the movement up? He doesn’t seem to care. Why should I?
What do you expect him to achieve? What would change your mind about him caring? What could he do going forward to earn your respect?
These are fair points. I don’t expect 49 hours of content to be high quality. You are asking the right questions though. I like where this is going!
If after ten years of streaming and media presence the most he can achieve is… More of the same, I count that as a loss. I do see him making bank though. Hasan has stopped most debates and has been adamant that they are useless. Where is the “turning point left”? Where is the canvassing? The fundraising? What legislation or policy is he pushing forward? He’s not a politician, but he has one of the biggest platforms and access. What is he doing with it?
I’m not saying for the democratic party. For any party. Something beyond media punditry. Kirk built up a whole movement that overturned an election. Young white males showed up in droves to vote. As much as I despise Kirk, I see the damage he did because of how effective he is. I wish those on the left could move beyond online punditry and into organizing.
He’s not a politician, but he has one of the biggest platforms and access. What is he doing with it?
I’m honestly not sure. I’ve seen him have a few interesting discussions with left leaning political figures so I assume there is more of that. I know Cuomo is, as of like a week ago, demanding that Mamdani condemn Hasan because he’s had a few pictures with him so again Hasan isn’t just doing nothing - he’s visible, though he may just be taking advantage of his status to pal around with popular people on the left. The few streams I’ve been linked to I recall feeling like he was honestly engaging topics on the left and making an effort to educate those watching. I’m not deep in his content so I don’t really know how often that happens or how accurate his “takes” are on average. My impression is that, on average, he far exceeds you assertion a 100% self-serving slop factory.
Kirk, I see the damage he did because of how effective he is.
Honestly, I saw him as just another gross, right wing internet personality spewing the kind of garbage that disgusts me. I assume he spends most of his time regurgitating the typical talking points of the right like a good little soldier. He’s maybe a bit more creative with his debate tactics. I’ve seen him masterfully dodging and manipulating the conversation to avoid having to actually defend his abhorrent views (like in his recent debate with those student in that British university), though he has also proudly taken disgusting stands without any shame and just basked in his own self righteousness. I am just not deep enough into the right wing internet sphere to consider him specifically effective. Just another loud, popular, well paid voice strengthening the right wing echo chamber.
Here’s what I think is more important. As I said before, I’ve heard multiple times that Hasan is “The Joe Rogan of the Left”. Again, I think it’s kind of apples and oranges but along those lines how much of what you’ve said would apply to Joe Rogan? Is he as openly political as Hasan? Is he as consistent with his views? Does he fundraise for the right or has he pushed for certain policies? I know he’s known for agreeing with whoever is in front him him and I don’t know of him doing anything more political than having a political person on his his show. Would you consider Joe Rogan to have had no impact on the success of the right? Could he disappear and the right wouldn’t notice?
Regardless of whether or not Hasan is actively maximizing the value of his political capital or wealth to change the world, he’s popular and he is openly, consistently left. More left than Destiny, who I (admittedly) recall being more politically proactive - I heard he was canvasing for 2024. I’m also not a Destiny follower so please don’t make me defend him. I’m a lefty who’s online enough that I’m familiar with a number of popular personalities because they bounce around and get mentioned in the space.
So Hasan could do more, sure. Hasan makes a substantial amount of money, yes. But, as far as popular strongly left-leaning personalities he has influence and I think he’s contributing a lot more than nothing. That’s why I’m countering your assessments.
You know what, I’ll gladly admit I did not bring enough specific receipts and I’m talking in broad terms (although I provided plenty of examples to support my point). My comment was also not about the interview in question. I agree: “assertions are not evidence”. That’s why I brought you some examples which you discounted or simply ignored. You don’t have to watch Hasan’s stream all day to see the difference in social impact he has against the tide that is the right wing media apparatus, because at the end of the day, and this is my main claim: Hasan is not interested in outcomes (except the one that generate revenue).
The point about him not understanding the Western Wall is not central to the claim that it discounts everything he says. It’s central to the claim that his stream is superficial slop content meant to generate views. I don’t know why this is so hard to grasp. If you’ve been covering Israel / Gaza for over two years and you still don’t know what the Western Wall is…That’s weird. It tells me you have no interest in covering this beyond an extremely superficial level. It’s Kony 2012 all over again.
I am making claims that would require you to verify them by consuming his content. I’ve been familiar with his content for over five years. I don’t need to watch his stream any more. I look at the sum total of his outcomes. What has he managed to achieve politically so far? What is he doing to build the movement up? He doesn’t seem to care. Why should I?
It’s only strange if you give weight to the specific religious claims to Jerusalem rather than the humanity of the people living there. The archeological significance of that wall doesn’t change the politics of Zionism or Palestinian liberation, nor should it.
It would be like complaining that someone doesn’t know the significance of the Black Stone in the Kaaba while discussing the geopolitical influence of Saudi Arabia at the UN. Is it a significant part of the mythology of Islam and the region broadly? Sure. Is it relevant to the actions taken by the Saudi government today? Uhhh, not really, no.
Sure. But you should at minimum know about it. You don’t have to talk about it every day. But if you professed to be an expert in Saudi geopolitics and you didn’t know what the Kaaba is then I really don’t see any reason to listen to you any longer. It’s getting ridiculous at this point
Maybe if he was a religious expert, but its not relevant to the geopolitics of the middle east.
You can stop listening to whoever you want at any time bud.
…
You’re “examples”, paraphrased:
He doesn’t know the significance of the Western Wall
He called an Israeli that wasn’t a settler or IDF and called for “peace and a ceasefire” a Nazi
Am I missing any?
I don’t know much about the significance or controversy of the Western Wall. It’s where politicians get photos taken when they want to demonstrate their Zionism. I don’t see the open air prison that is Gaza, or it’s destruction, or the Settlements in the West Bank being directly related to the Western Wall.
I don’t know anything about the interview or the guys comments on this allegedly reasonable, peaceful Israeli. Maybe he just decided a week before the interview that enough is enough. Maybe he is perfectly fine with the situation in the West Bank and the open air prison of Gaza, he just wants to stop worrying about the geopolitics of the conflict and his own safety. I don’t know because you did nothing but make assertions.
Your points, paraphrased:
He just reads Twitter
His content is just slop
He doesn’t care, he just wants money
He doesn’t just reads Twitter. He’s been on TV, He’s been in debates (literally was scheduled to debate Kirk in like a week or two as per this interview). I’ve seen him visiting other political programs. I’m not a fan but it’s obvious he does more than Twitter.
The content I’ve described above is more than slop. He allegedly averages 49 hours a week. A lot of that is going to be trash and low effort. It’s not all he seems to do.
Does he run ads for his own products, like the other grifters? Does he shift his position to maximize viewership or is he principled? I have seen and products (though I don’t really follow) and he has seemed pretty principled. Does he make money? Yes, he’s the largest streamer/influencer on the left. I’ve heard him called the Joe Rogan of the left and that we need of him. While I think that is a ignorant simplification and a bad metaphor, it sounds like he’s at least not just feeding rage bait and slop the entire time.
What do you expect him to achieve? What would change your mind about him caring? What could he do going forward to earn your respect?
These are fair points. I don’t expect 49 hours of content to be high quality. You are asking the right questions though. I like where this is going!
If after ten years of streaming and media presence the most he can achieve is… More of the same, I count that as a loss. I do see him making bank though. Hasan has stopped most debates and has been adamant that they are useless. Where is the “turning point left”? Where is the canvassing? The fundraising? What legislation or policy is he pushing forward? He’s not a politician, but he has one of the biggest platforms and access. What is he doing with it?
I’m not saying for the democratic party. For any party. Something beyond media punditry. Kirk built up a whole movement that overturned an election. Young white males showed up in droves to vote. As much as I despise Kirk, I see the damage he did because of how effective he is. I wish those on the left could move beyond online punditry and into organizing.
I’m honestly not sure. I’ve seen him have a few interesting discussions with left leaning political figures so I assume there is more of that. I know Cuomo is, as of like a week ago, demanding that Mamdani condemn Hasan because he’s had a few pictures with him so again Hasan isn’t just doing nothing - he’s visible, though he may just be taking advantage of his status to pal around with popular people on the left. The few streams I’ve been linked to I recall feeling like he was honestly engaging topics on the left and making an effort to educate those watching. I’m not deep in his content so I don’t really know how often that happens or how accurate his “takes” are on average. My impression is that, on average, he far exceeds you assertion a 100% self-serving slop factory.
Honestly, I saw him as just another gross, right wing internet personality spewing the kind of garbage that disgusts me. I assume he spends most of his time regurgitating the typical talking points of the right like a good little soldier. He’s maybe a bit more creative with his debate tactics. I’ve seen him masterfully dodging and manipulating the conversation to avoid having to actually defend his abhorrent views (like in his recent debate with those student in that British university), though he has also proudly taken disgusting stands without any shame and just basked in his own self righteousness. I am just not deep enough into the right wing internet sphere to consider him specifically effective. Just another loud, popular, well paid voice strengthening the right wing echo chamber.
Here’s what I think is more important. As I said before, I’ve heard multiple times that Hasan is “The Joe Rogan of the Left”. Again, I think it’s kind of apples and oranges but along those lines how much of what you’ve said would apply to Joe Rogan? Is he as openly political as Hasan? Is he as consistent with his views? Does he fundraise for the right or has he pushed for certain policies? I know he’s known for agreeing with whoever is in front him him and I don’t know of him doing anything more political than having a political person on his his show. Would you consider Joe Rogan to have had no impact on the success of the right? Could he disappear and the right wouldn’t notice?
Regardless of whether or not Hasan is actively maximizing the value of his political capital or wealth to change the world, he’s popular and he is openly, consistently left. More left than Destiny, who I (admittedly) recall being more politically proactive - I heard he was canvasing for 2024. I’m also not a Destiny follower so please don’t make me defend him. I’m a lefty who’s online enough that I’m familiar with a number of popular personalities because they bounce around and get mentioned in the space.
So Hasan could do more, sure. Hasan makes a substantial amount of money, yes. But, as far as popular strongly left-leaning personalities he has influence and I think he’s contributing a lot more than nothing. That’s why I’m countering your assessments.