• Ech@lemm.eeEnglish
    1231·
    11 months ago

    5.0.1: Before using the website, remember you will be interacting with actual, real people and communities. Lemmy.World is not a place for you to attack other groups of people. Every one of our users has a right to browse and interact with the website and all of its contents free of treatment such as harassment, bullying, violation of privacy or threats of violence.

    • MrMusAddict@lemmy.worldEnglish
      461·
      11 months ago

      In my opinion this is actually better than the CoC. The only thing “missing” is the definition of which qualities you shouldn’t discriminate against. But that’s now generalized into “groups of people”.

      I still can’t discriminate against people based on any qualification. Hell, I technically can’t discriminate against “pineapple on pizza eaters”.

      • Dharma Curious@startrek.website
        487·
        11 months ago

        Good. Because it’s fucking delicious and I don’t care what the internet says. We all loved it in the 90s, and nothing has changed. It’s still delicious, we just do less coke now.

        • xigoi@lemmy.sdf.org
          72·
          11 months ago

          You can discriminate all you want, you just can’t harass, bully, violate privacy or threaten violence.

          • PM_ME_FAT_ENBIES@lib.lgbtEnglish
            2·
            11 months ago

            Yeah, the lemmy.world admin in this thread is flat out lying when they say discrimination is banned. No rule against slurs, rumours, or stereotypes. Or just generalised hate.

        • taladar@sh.itjust.works
          51·
          11 months ago

          I think you can’t read it too literally. Otherwise you also can’t discriminate against “people who wrote their comment later” and so you can never stop reading the comments for fear of discriminating between “early comment writers” and “late comment writers”.

          • snooggums@kbin.social
            91·
            11 months ago

            Literal is the only way these things are supposed to be read.

            They could easily fix it by saying “groups (except for those that promote discrimination and/or hate such as nazis and racists)”

        • MrMusAddict@lemmy.worldEnglish
          25·
          11 months ago

          I just replied this to another commenter, but that’s a bad faith argument. The ToS also says to not engage in illegal activity. The admonishment of Nazi’s and Racists is an admonishment of illegal evil.

          • lolcatnip@reddthat.comEnglish
            8·
            11 months ago

            Being a Nazi is not illegal in most jurisdictions. It certainly wasn’t illegal in Nazi Germany.

          • PM_ME_FAT_ENBIES@lib.lgbtEnglish
            1·
            11 months ago

            Bruh I hate to break this to you but nearly all governments are racist. Have you not heard of what the US did to black people for 300 years?

      • TWeaK@lemm.eeEnglish
        7·
        11 months ago

        By my reading of it, you can still discriminate against pineapple pizza eaters, or any other group whatsoever, you just can’t harass, bully, violate their privacy or threaten them with violence. Which is fine by me, if someone wants to make a community only for ginger haired people and ban anyone they think isn’t naturally ginger, that’s their perogative.

        • AFK BRB Chocolate@lemmy.worldEnglish
          6·
          11 months ago

          That was my takeaway, too, and I think it’s positive. The nice thing is, if it turns out that the policy fosters behavior that’s bad for the broader community, they can change it.

            • AFK BRB Chocolate@lemmy.worldEnglish
              4·
              11 months ago

              Some people have given you guys a lot of flack, but I really think you’re making a thoughtful, good faith effort to do things right, and I think you’re doing well. There have been a couple things that I thought were the wrong decision, but (1) they’ve been relatively minor, and (2) they’ve been reasonable even if I might have chosen differently. I very much appreciate the thought that goes into running this place.

            • PM_ME_FAT_ENBIES@lib.lgbtEnglish
              2·
              11 months ago

              So you totally invited the OP of this post to discuss and provide feedback, right? You didn’t immediately go nuclear on the slightest criticism, ban them to keep them from discussing the problem further, and refuse to change the rules?

      • Rivalarrival@lemmy.today
        96·
        11 months ago

        Nazis are a group of people. Republicans are a group of people. Pedophiles are a group of people.

        • MrMusAddict@lemmy.worldEnglish
          117·
          11 months ago

          That’s a bad faith argument. The ToS also says to not engage in illegal activity. The admonishment of Nazi’s and Pedophiles is an admonishment of illegal evil.

          Your inclusion of Republicans is a bit of an extreme juxtaposition. Feel free to admonish the individual evil views of Republicans, but to discriminate against Republicans purely for their association is rightly against ToS.

    • boatswain@infosec.pub
      51·
      11 months ago

      Need some context here: is this what we removed, something that’s already somewhere else, a proposed replacement, or something else?

  • Izzy@lemmy.ml
    456·
    11 months ago

    Well they banned me for saying I don’t like ads and called it harassment. They have no idea what they are doing and are not fit to be admins of anything.

    • cwagner@lemmy.cwagner.me
      151·
      11 months ago

      Argh. Now I‘m on your side here, and think the ban was neither justified nor was their policy of “Everyone STFU this thread is now locked, you are all dumb” in any way something that makes me think communities should be hosted on lemmy.world. But calling it “saying I don’t like ads” is utterly ridiculous.

      • Izzy@lemmy.ml
        111·
        11 months ago

        Every comment is still available to read at the moment. This doesn’t seem like the place for a long and elaborate recap. That’s pretty much what it boils down to though. The irony is that several people harassed me and they are completely fine with that because it supports their biased opinion. If you look through their comment history they are very supportive of this particular piece of software. So anything against this is bad and must be banned. It likely wouldn’t even matter what it is. They just ban first and justify it later and make up some nonsense such as “harassment”.

        The double irony is that they are going to end up harming lemmy.world and possibly do irreparable damage to the lemmyverse long term and then their friend will no longer be able to profit much from ads.

        • TWeaK@lemm.eeEnglish
          1·
          11 months ago

          Which app are you referring to? Bluesky?

          Mainly I want to know so I can avoid it, although I’m already avoiding Bluesky.

          • Izzy@lemmy.ml
            91·
            11 months ago

            I don’t think BlueSky has ads. At least not yet. The dispute is mainly around the mobile Lemmy app Sync. Which is a mobile UI for lemmy that inserts ads into Lemmy where there previously were none.

            • TWeaK@lemm.eeEnglish
              2·
              11 months ago

              Ah right, fair enough. I hadn’t realised Sync was doing that - I’ve been lazy and stuck with Jerboa.

              The website seems to generally be the best way to browse lemmy anyway, particularly with its continued development. Apps quite often dont’ conform to things lemmy does, like automatically making instance agnostic links out of /c/[email protected], or the drop down box for typing a username and sending them a mention.

    • Kayn@dormi.zone
      93·
      11 months ago

      Unless you provide the exact text you were banned for, I’ll be having my doubts.

    • 𝒍𝒆𝒎𝒂𝒏𝒏@lemmy.one
      3·
      11 months ago

      Was this during the sync thing?

      To be honest as a mod or admin I would personally get sick of reading the same things over and over again, with sync fans attacking staunch FOSSers and staunch FOSSers attacking sync fans. It only served to get both sides upset for literally no reason, and fracture the community even more.

      Their inboxes would have also likely been flooded out to death during that time with both sides reporting each other over petty remarks

      Doesn’t make it right, however I can see why it happened. Probably another reason behind the “dont report something unless its against the terms” rule.

      • Izzy@lemmy.ml
        51·
        11 months ago

        I’ve definitely never reported anyone related to this. They came to a FOSS community and then got upset when people criticize the propritizing of FOSS software. They should change the rules to not allow any criticize of the ad business model instead of banning people for made up reasons. 🤷

  • InternetTubes@kbin.social
    201·
    11 months ago

    Seriously, this is the least of its problems, but it certainly hints at them: https://kbin.social/m/RedditMigration/t/554307/Just-wanted-a-warning-Lemmy-World-is-perhaps-worse-than-reddit

    Basically, they don’t even follow the examples they set in their Terms of Service and will not only ban but purge your entire comment account on a whim because they didn’t like the criticism they said they were open to on a post stating that “users may express their questions, concerns, requests and issues regarding the Terms of Service, and content moderation in Lemmy.World.” There’s no doubt, they were pretty clear they considered the criticism “disagreeing with the terms of service”.

    Create your user on another instance and save yourself the surprise of encountering admins who abuse their power on a whim. That can be your entire account history down the drain, and the number of comments or the age of the account won’t matter to them.

    • Izzy@lemmy.ml
      142·
      11 months ago

      This is exactly what I experienced when I was part of their top moderator and ban discussion discord channels. They would regularly ban people for little to no reason and then laugh about it and then realize they need to come up with reasons after the fact. This is also how they deal with defederation. They had defederated an instance more than once prior to having any concrete reasons to do so. They operate on gut feeling and disregard their own rules and ToS on the regular.

      Not even Reddit is so unprofessional.

      • Ech@lemm.eeEnglish
        111·
        11 months ago

        Interesting you only have a problem with this after you got kicked out. Certainly no reason it could be exaggerated or straight up untrue. 🤔

  • qaz@lemmy.world
    155·
    11 months ago

    Have you asked the admins/mods of lemmy.world about this before posting this?

    • vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone
      126·
      11 months ago

      Against their political view that racial bigotry discrimination is bad? I sure hope so.

      • Łumało [he/him]@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
        165·
        11 months ago

        Well they clearly don’t like me saying “From the river to the sea.”

        So are they really against racial bigotry and discrimination?

          • Łumało [he/him]@lemmygrad.mlEnglish
            92·
            11 months ago

            So will you go from hearsay and idiotic lies or actually engage me or visit lemmygrad for yourself?

            This accusation could’ve been “You’re literally from Poland.”, and it would’ve just as little ground to stand on.

        • PM_ME_FAT_ENBIES@lib.lgbtEnglish
          41·
          11 months ago

          Israel and Jews are not the same thing. Israel is a country for the Jews who happen to be racist colonisers. Every ethnic/religious group has racists in it, and the ones stealing homes in Palestine are the racist Jews. Most Jewish people don’t live in Israel, because most of them aren’t racist.

            • PM_ME_FAT_ENBIES@lib.lgbtEnglish
              3·
              11 months ago

              Jewish people are not flawless paragons. To portray them as such is to deify and other them, striping them off their humanity. They are human beings, flawed in all the same ways the rest of humanity is flawed. That includes, in many but not all, racism. It’s not antisemitic to say that some are racist. They’re human, and racism is a very human trait. You’re the antisemite. You deny them the flaws of being human, and other them as universally perfect.

  • krolden@lemmy.ml
    714·
    11 months ago

    The worst part about lemmy world is that all the tech discussions seemed to have moved there. Granted a lot of them are people who dont RTFM but still its not a good consolidation of discussion.

  • HardlightCereal@lemmy.worldOPEnglish
    1936·
    11 months ago

    The new rules also say you’re not allowed to report content for things that aren’t a violation of the terms of service. So if you report a content for being racist, that’s against the rules.

    • 𝒍𝒆𝒎𝒂𝒏𝒏@lemmy.one
      211·
      11 months ago

      Unless they changed it - the last time I checked there was an exception for posts violating community rules, so communities who want to exempt themselves can just add a rule IMO

      From my perspective, communities in general instantly remove racist content once reported, and most racial slurs in these contexts are used as a personal attack towards another individual.

      🔥HOT TAKE: There are contexts where racial slurs could be used without bad intentions, such as in a car visual customization community, or in a community with people of colour referencing each other. These slurs are especially used among younger age groups in a casual manner, who may not consider such terms offensive at their current point in life. Of course, such communities can just ban these terms outright with a new rule.

      Unless i’m missing something, I don’t see the problem with this