No, this is an ultimatum, not ‘expressing her feelings’.
It is a threat, quite literally, and that in fact is a problem… healthy relationships do not involve threats.
This is not ‘hey, instead of video games tonight, could we maybe go on a walk, or out to dinner, or maybe cook dinner together, or go see a movie? Oh you had a scheduled match… hrm, maybe this weekend?’
That you think this is narcissism betrays that you are, at best, very bad at communicating, and at worst, are yourself a narcissist who is projecting.
If one is too shallow to understand that ‘video games’ is a stand-in for a much broader problem, leave them. They are either really fucking stupid, a narcissist, or both.
Are you able to concieve that video games are a fun and enjoyable hobby?
Does it occur to you that perhaps a balance can be reached other than ‘100% partner 0% video games’ or ‘0% partner 100% video games’?
Is it abuse to … not do anything other than exactly what your partner wants, when they want it, or else they will leave you?
Has it occured to you that… your mindset is the extremist, totally black and white thinking, no room for compromise, the worst possible interpetation is always the assumed default…
Has it occured to you that that is the abusive mindset?
No. He’d dump her, then come back all apologetic less than 24 hours later, beg for forgiveness, and promise to change. He’d make grand gestures in the first few days and make her feel like he might be serious this time. Within a week, whatever it was will have become her fault, she’ll always have been the real abuser in the situation, and he’ll punish her by withdrawing until she interprets his vague, passive-aggressive hints correctly in order to atone for her sins against him in the only way he has deemed appropriate. This whole thing will be just one one in a long line of many similar incidents, which have escalated over enough time that he has convinced her that she is, in fact, the bad one and that she deserves to be treated this way because of it. She’ll have been kept on an emotional rollercoaster for so long that when (if) the relationship finally does end, it will take a very long time for her to be able to identify the pattern.
He would absolutely say that he’s dumping her and tell her how fucked up she is for even bringing HER problem to him in the first place. He wouldn’t get in any hurry to actually leave, though. The longer he can keep her in her head and wondering what is actually going on, the better.
Yes, “It’s me or your video games” strongly suggests, in this fictional scenario, that it’s by no means the first time this issue has been brought up. Even if that were the case, however, the reply by the guy would be arrogant and selfish, since it ignores his partner’s needs instead of respecting them.
Maybe, maybe not. It could be that he’s actually neglecting her for video games. It could be that her idea of “neglect” is any time at all pursuing his own hobbies. Both scenarios occur, I don’t think it’s reasonable to say this “strongly” suggests one in particular.
Yeah, armchair psychologists often like to throw out the “this isn’t what it seems” argument with such conviction that they forget that it still definitely could be what it seems.
I suppose that would be a gotcha if I we’re actually trying to read into a scenario I know nothing about, rather than just calling someone else out for doing so.
I don’t think it’s [not] reasonable to say this “strongly” suggests one in particular.
Disagree. He had a choice to either hear that she was experience pain/duress or that she’s exaggerating and/or misunderstanding. In either case, if he truly cares about her then he could/should seek to understand, communicate, and (if appropriate) compromise. That he immediately dismissed her and only talked of himself makes it clear that he’s an uncaring narcissist.
I appreciate that you want to give him the benefit of the doubt. Narcissists depend on this. When they show you who they are, believe them.
He had a choice to either hear that she was experience pain/duress or that she’s exaggerating and/or misunderstanding.
And she had a chance to communicate her frustrations without making an ultimatum.
That he immediately dismissed her and only talked of himself makes it clear that he’s an uncaring narcissist.
That she immediately issued an ultimatum instead of trying to open a productive dialogue about it more strongly suggests that she’s the uncaring narcissist. Ultimatums aren’t healthy.
In any case, this response isn’t very helpful, since it doesn’t aim to resolve the conflict. Ending the relationship might be the solution—but even then, it probably wouldn’t be the most conciliatory way to part ways.
I simply assume that most people are capable of communicating with one another. If that isn’t the case in a relationship—whatever the reason may be—I don’t think the relationship will last long—at least not if everyone involved is supposed to be happy in it.
I think you’re totally right, but also don’t underestimate the average person’s willingness to tolerate being in a bad or even toxic relationship. A lot of those folks are commenting here in this thread
Thanks. Yea, it seems I didn’t take some sensitivities into account in my comment, judging by the downvotes it received. It was by no means my intention to upset anyone; I simply wanted to express my belief that it’s a good thing to treat each other with respect and show understanding for one another, even if that can sometimes be difficult.
At least for me, this has always worked pretty well in relationships, which is why I thought I’d recommend it.
An expert display of narcissism. He completely dismisses how she feels and then tells her that she is the problem.
Hahaha wow no.
No, this is an ultimatum, not ‘expressing her feelings’.
It is a threat, quite literally, and that in fact is a problem… healthy relationships do not involve threats.
This is not ‘hey, instead of video games tonight, could we maybe go on a walk, or out to dinner, or maybe cook dinner together, or go see a movie? Oh you had a scheduled match… hrm, maybe this weekend?’
That you think this is narcissism betrays that you are, at best, very bad at communicating, and at worst, are yourself a narcissist who is projecting.
narcissist for not tolerating manipulation and abuse?
Narcissist for being the abuser, not giving a fuck about her, and making it all about himself.
if someone threatens to break up with you over some video games, RUN
If one is too shallow to understand that ‘video games’ is a stand-in for a much broader problem, leave them. They are either really fucking stupid, a narcissist, or both.
Are you able to concieve that video games are a fun and enjoyable hobby?
Does it occur to you that perhaps a balance can be reached other than ‘100% partner 0% video games’ or ‘0% partner 100% video games’?
Is it abuse to … not do anything other than exactly what your partner wants, when they want it, or else they will leave you?
Has it occured to you that… your mindset is the extremist, totally black and white thinking, no room for compromise, the worst possible interpetation is always the assumed default…
Has it occured to you that that is the abusive mindset?
is your favorite song Assumptions?
Hmm yeah “how she feels” being a manipulative ultimatum
The narcissist wouldn’t dump her over it, he’d apologize and keep doing it.
Edit: I appear to have grossly oversimplified narcissists.
No. He’d dump her, then come back all apologetic less than 24 hours later, beg for forgiveness, and promise to change. He’d make grand gestures in the first few days and make her feel like he might be serious this time. Within a week, whatever it was will have become her fault, she’ll always have been the real abuser in the situation, and he’ll punish her by withdrawing until she interprets his vague, passive-aggressive hints correctly in order to atone for her sins against him in the only way he has deemed appropriate. This whole thing will be just one one in a long line of many similar incidents, which have escalated over enough time that he has convinced her that she is, in fact, the bad one and that she deserves to be treated this way because of it. She’ll have been kept on an emotional rollercoaster for so long that when (if) the relationship finally does end, it will take a very long time for her to be able to identify the pattern.
I have some first-hand experience in this area.
He would absolutely say that he’s dumping her and tell her how fucked up she is for even bringing HER problem to him in the first place. He wouldn’t get in any hurry to actually leave, though. The longer he can keep her in her head and wondering what is actually going on, the better.
Yes, “It’s me or your video games” strongly suggests, in this fictional scenario, that it’s by no means the first time this issue has been brought up. Even if that were the case, however, the reply by the guy would be arrogant and selfish, since it ignores his partner’s needs instead of respecting them.
Maybe, maybe not. It could be that he’s actually neglecting her for video games. It could be that her idea of “neglect” is any time at all pursuing his own hobbies. Both scenarios occur, I don’t think it’s reasonable to say this “strongly” suggests one in particular.
Yeah, armchair psychologists often like to throw out the “this isn’t what it seems” argument with such conviction that they forget that it still definitely could be what it seems.
… he says from his armchair
I suppose that would be a gotcha if I we’re actually trying to read into a scenario I know nothing about, rather than just calling someone else out for doing so.
Eh I’m just teasing you it’s all good
I guess I’m just an armchair armchair-spotter, haha!
True
I don’t thinkit’s [not] reasonable to say this “strongly” suggests one in particular.Disagree. He had a choice to either hear that she was experience pain/duress or that she’s exaggerating and/or misunderstanding. In either case, if he truly cares about her then he could/should seek to understand, communicate, and (if appropriate) compromise. That he immediately dismissed her and only talked of himself makes it clear that he’s an uncaring narcissist.
I appreciate that you want to give him the benefit of the doubt. Narcissists depend on this. When they show you who they are, believe them.
And she had a chance to communicate her frustrations without making an ultimatum.
That she immediately issued an ultimatum instead of trying to open a productive dialogue about it more strongly suggests that she’s the uncaring narcissist. Ultimatums aren’t healthy.
In any case, this response isn’t very helpful, since it doesn’t aim to resolve the conflict. Ending the relationship might be the solution—but even then, it probably wouldn’t be the most conciliatory way to part ways.
I simply assume that most people are capable of communicating with one another. If that isn’t the case in a relationship—whatever the reason may be—I don’t think the relationship will last long—at least not if everyone involved is supposed to be happy in it.
That is not at all a safe assumption.
Yeah, looks like it.
I think you’re totally right, but also don’t underestimate the average person’s willingness to tolerate being in a bad or even toxic relationship. A lot of those folks are commenting here in this thread
Thanks. Yea, it seems I didn’t take some sensitivities into account in my comment, judging by the downvotes it received. It was by no means my intention to upset anyone; I simply wanted to express my belief that it’s a good thing to treat each other with respect and show understanding for one another, even if that can sometimes be difficult.
At least for me, this has always worked pretty well in relationships, which is why I thought I’d recommend it.